In this thought-provoking discussion, Malcolm and Simone Collins delve into Andrew Tate's controversial proposal for solving the demographic crisis through polygamy. They analyze Tate's argument, which criticizes the Western monogamous model and promotes a return to a more traditional, patriarchal family structure. The hosts explore the cultural and genetic implications of polygyny, comparing Tate's Muslim-influenced perspective with the traditional American view of gender roles. They also examine the potential consequences of polygamy on both men and women, and discuss the importance of fostering independence and ambition in future generations. Ultimately, Malcolm and Simone argue that while Tate's approach may work for him personally, it is not a viable long-term solution for their own family or for society as a whole.
[00:00:00]
Malcolm Collins: Hello, Simone. This episode is going to be great because it's another Andrew Tate episode. So I need my sword again. Women won't respect him unless he is Physically threatening them with a sword.
You got your sword.
Your wife starts talking. You're like, shut up. She's got a sword. If every man on earth walked around with a sword, most of the issues of the world, would basically go away. We can fix this.
It can all be fixed. You just need to carry a sword around your house.
Malcolm Collins: And I need to do that too. That's how I keep my wife in line.
Simone Collins: This, the sword.
Malcolm Collins: , Andrew Tate has outlaid a plan for solving demographic collapse.
Simone Collins: Are you serious? Did this actually happen?
Malcolm Collins: I am serious. And it is as unhinged in a based way. Like I [00:01:00] like thinking outside the box, but it is very on brand. And I think it might be one of the most crazy things he said recently. That's
Simone Collins: saying a lot.
Would you like to know more?
Malcolm Collins: Dear white men, you're fucked. You're being replaced because none of you have children. Even those of you bitching about the replacement online like little girls don't find the gumption to fuck. I see white men bragging about having five kids as if it's an achievement.
LOL 5 LOLOL per year, right? Oh, all you white boys lost control of your women, and now they won't accept multiple wives anymore. Now they tell you they don't want any more kids. One's enough. They don't want to do their God given job anymore. No, they want Instagram likes [00:02:00] instead. So your genetic potential is stumped by the whims of some singular female.
A female who takes nine whole months To grow a single baby. Other races have multiple ovens for bread. We're not cucked. Some bitch is screaming at you about loyalty. And you're sitting there saying, Yes, baby. Jerking off to porn when she's asleep or maybe cheating with a side bitch. Condom on.
Hold on. I love this because this is the take that we've had that non reproductive sex is just masturbation. It is a kink. And I love that he has correlated jerking off to porn as being just as disgusting as sleeping, cheating on your wife with a condom on. Great, take care of yourself, okay.
Oh no! I couldn't get another woman pregnant? My wife would kill me! Exclamation [00:03:00] mark, concerned emoji. Total fucking losers. Soon your race will be nothing more than a few pages in a history book. A lesson on what happens when you fuck with a female psyche. They're obsessed with money and social media, as opposed to being one of many baby factories for a king.
30 children minimum for the Dons. White people, go talk to your quote unquote best friend wife about what you do this weekend. Maybe you can take a nice walk around IKEA. Enjoy extinction.
Simone Collins: Okay. Wow, that's so great.
Malcolm Collins: So first I want to point something out because I always tell people, Andrew Tate's idea about male and female roles is not the Western ideal and it is certainly not the Americana ideal.
It is a Muslim ideal and they're like, no, Andrew Tate isn't about [00:04:00] promoting like the Muslim cultural idea of how you should structure relationships. I'm sorry. How can you read that? And think literally anything else. He does not and the Muslim ideal can work like and to be honest, like he's not promoting something that doesn't work or that doesn't lead to higher fertility within some cultural groups where you have the top men in a society having multiple wives and then using that to produce a huge number of kids, right?
And it is a lifestyle that I love that he is undertaking it is not championing
Simone Collins: note. He's like bringing, he's bringing polygamy into the modern internet world. This is some pioneering work here. What can we say?
Malcolm Collins: And it like, I actually like with Andrew Tate, so we're, we have a video that's come out on Hamza.
He's like another, like men's influencer. You know what I mean? Like leading with this male aesthetic. I don't really respect Hansa, [00:05:00] I think he had a perfect life with this woman, and he left her so he could go partying in cities with Instagram babes, and he even says that pathetic, honestly, pathetic, and I'm glad he's getting back with this woman, and I hope he can get himself sorted out.
basically I'm starting the fatherhood chapter of my life. We're not pregnant just yet, but we've moved to the Scottish Highlands,
The reason why me and my ex split up is I told her to sit down and to write down like her goals and I wrote, you know what, I want to move to like a big city.
You will not find this kind of woman who will fit with this lifestyle in a big major city why?
The women who are in the big cities are glorified Instagram prostitution.
I actually want to have a few like, Sleepless nights.
I want to have a few likes like sleep deprived nights where I stay up late bro for the last few years I've been to sleep at 7 8 p. m I've you couldn't imagine the amount of like parties and social events and dinners that I've missed
I know what goes on in these parties And the issue was that the girls that I was meeting from these places, just like I, I was as well, um, We're all [00:06:00] low quality.
It's a low quality place to be.
. I wanted to be super social. I wanted to have some late nights where we stay up and we're social and there's a party that we go to and everything.
But she saw it, and I'm not gonna lie, like, I could see how, like, offended she was. Where she was quite, like, pressuring, she was like, Wait, you wanna do this? Oh, you wanna do that? You wanna stay up late? But that's unhealthy.
Those party girls, like the party, low quality, degenerate, TikTok type of girls.
They are attracted to the party, low quality, degenerate, TikTok type of guys. Fine, like trash can stay with trash.
Because for hers, she wrote that she wanted to do more of the things that we were currently doing. , it's wholesome as fuck, and you know that she's an awesome girl for that, she doesn't want to be around like, You know, like party girls and whatever I just realized like we're actually going into two separate seasons right now
Fine, like trash can stay with trash.
Malcolm Collins: When you Define your moral system around an aesthetic.
It needs to be witnessed to have value. And when he got to the countryside, there was no one to witness affirmation from the social community
[00:07:00] Witness me!
Mediocre!
This is the person who aesthetically wants to be a father that fits his ideal of where he should be going in life. But it's completely unwilling to make any of the sacrifices that are associated with that. That he's complaining about not being able to regularly leave the house after seven or eight.
That is a normal part of being a parent he's not. Willing to make the sacrifices associated.
Was transitioning to the next stage of his life, which will lead him down a path worse than being a Jeremy. which is what he calls like, I guess, losers. , he's going to become the crack Fox. Once upon a time, there was a fox and he was called Jerome. He lived in the woods in Elderberrywood. They spent their days punting down the lazy rivers of Cambridge Town. One day, whilst relaxing, he found a copy of Cheekbone Magazine. And he [00:08:00] read an article about London life. And then, decided he was gonna go to London.
Three weeks later, he was off his tiny face in a gay club. But the party lifestyle took its toll. Eventually he ended up on the streets, begging for cheese and Alston.
This is going to sound weird, you need to be hit in the face. I will repeat that again. As a young man, you need to be hit in the face consistently.
Malcolm Collins: Andrew Tate he has chosen a different optimization function than me.
Simone Collins: Yes. But
Malcolm Collins: it is not necessarily an incorrect optimization function. And it seems
Simone Collins: like the right optimization function for him. He doesn't seem like a monogamous, settle down, move to the countryside kind of guy.
Andrew Tate. Is kind of a goofy guy. Was it different optimization function than us in a different cultural background than us? But I respect his level of baseness in his level to live a Grinch, the grain of [00:09:00] society. And his follow through and the things that he says Here is another great quote that he tweeted recently sexist for making children, any man who has sex with a woman because it quote, unquote feels good is gay. Oh, my PP feels so good. This is great. In fact, if you are at 40, with less than five children, you're probably gay. All that feel good.
PPE sex. Sex and hardly any genetic legacy question, mark. I mean, to be honest, when we talk about changing culture, Right. It doesn't make sense. Like the reason why culturally, we used to shame people for being gay was because the cultures that did that ended up having a higher number of surviving offspring. 'cause they pressured the men who were born with same-sex attraction to have heterosexual relationships.
What injury Tate is doing in this tweet is adapting that shaming and that cultural concept for a much bigger threat in society [00:10:00] today. Which is condoms. They're not ending up having kids for some other reason, which is just so intelligent. And in cool, even if it's the strategy that we would use.
Malcolm Collins: yeah, and there's an analogy I came up with recently that I really like about male female dimorphism which is that human males and human females evolved differently.
Like we are biologically and psychologically different from each other. You can think of this as like in a society where people are Everyone's assigned a swiss army knife at birth and they are slightly different brands of swiss army knife with different tools within them You know different size knives everything like that between cultures and then people take that to be like, oh, there's this morally correct way to deal with these differences That is not true, you know in a culture that grew up, you know near a coastal region It might actually be the thinner knife that's used for butchering animals and in a crowd that grew up in an arctic region where they were hunting like mammoth.[00:11:00]
Oh no. The hunting group is always the one that had the thicker knife. There are many optimization functions that can even work within a single environment. And the ways that we use these tools are going to change over times. When we are a space during race, it may turn out that what was originally meant to be like a corkscrew in the Swiss army knife is now perfect for, um, handling some sort of like oxygen tank or something like that on the ship.
And in our society right now, women being more like social, like in a historic context, that was totally different than them navigating the bureaucracies that they navigate today at a higher rate than men navigate. And so if we don't take that into account that contexts have changed and that so one, the way that we relate to gender changes over time, but two different cultural groups historically related to gender differently.
And he's from a cultural group that really did relate to women in this way, much more in a historical context. And he's leaned even further into that with his recent Muslim conversion. But then, so the question [00:12:00] comes, Why don't we choose this strategy? Like, why do we think this strategy is bad?
One thing he's wrong about, like Simone, would you be like, am I not allowed to marry another woman?
Simone Collins: I wouldn't be into that. You could, you are welcome to be with anyone that you want. I hate people too much to have a household full of additional people. I'm sorry. It's not that I'm not willing to share you.
It's that I cannot deal with more
Malcolm Collins: people. So you see, I am cucked by my wife, right? She says, I would be less happy if you married another woman. And I take that into account, right? But and here's the key thing. So why am I dealing with that limitation on my fertility?
Like why would I do that?
Why would a culture do that? An
Simone Collins: argument that I would make, and I imagine you're going to make this as well, is that if we want to, one, be among the cultures that is technologically dominant and intellectually [00:13:00] dominant, and that is to say, building the future, like literally the group that builds the infrastructure that takes us to the stars and ultimately runs it and decides who gets to go where you need to have maximum firing power on All ends.
So both genders need to be high caliber and you're not going to create a culture with high caliber women. When the women are simultaneously subjugated in a way where they're seen as less and they're part of the stable and they're part of this harem or whatever it might be. So I think, we can't inspire smart, ambitious daughters who we want to have in our culture.
To get married and have kids, if doing so involves being with someone like Andrew Tate.
Malcolm Collins: And I think that's the key answer here, but I want to elaborate on it a bit more because then, it also has genetic effects and stuff like that. Like Andrew Tate could not secure a woman like Simone.
Andrew Tate is always talking about how women are like, not as smart as men and blah, blah, blah, and the that they can't have [00:14:00] intellectual or philosophical conversations. And what this tells me, because I haven't experienced that in the women I'm engaging with or in the woman that I married, So why is it that I haven't experienced that, but he has, it's because what he was bringing to the table when he was out there trying to attract women to sleep with was specifically filtering for these women that were in an incredibly low intellectual caliber, because that's the type of woman that goes for a guy like that, that splits like that.
And there's actually been studies on this. Yeah, there's a really fascinating setting. I've never been able to find it, but I remember going over it when I was in psychology school, like getting my degree in psychology and neuroscience that looked at. A culture that was polygynous where you had one men, man, and many woman,
Simone Collins: and
Malcolm Collins: that Women, they're like the top men in that society actually got lower quality wives than in nearby monogamous societies where these extreme top tier women were actually sorting for mid tier men in terms of like wealth and stuff like
Simone Collins: that.
I think I've seen this, [00:15:00] but it's looking at it's looking at polygamy in Africa. So looking at the evaluations that women are making and specifically it, they have to decide, do I want. If I go for a high value man, I know that I'm going to have to share him. So I have to dilute his current wealth or value or power by the number of anticipated wives, even if I'm wife, number one, therefore a high value man is actually lower value because I'm actually going to get just one fifth of him, one 10th of him, one third of him.
And so going for a mid tier man who you anticipate. To have only one wife . Could you know it, it could more So you see this in the
Malcolm Collins: data is the point. Yeah. Like that they do get lower quality wives. But it also reminded me of something that Hamza said in one of his videos where he was talking about why he loves foreign women over western women.
And he was like, oh. And they're short. It's so hot. How short they are. Oh my God, how no. I was like,
Simone Collins: no man in this space who's even slightly adjacent [00:16:00] to the black pill space, could possibly say something like that. No. No man. That could ever. Actively tried to reproduce with a shorter woman because he understands how important height is for men.
Unless he plans on doing IVF and eliminating all, like
Malcolm Collins: They deal with this cloud. They deal with this brain cloud, right? That's so weird. They don't understand that half of your son's genes are coming from their mother. When you select for women who are innately subordinate and who are dumb, you are creating sons who are half subordinate.
When you have sex with short women, it's the same thing. This is something that was completely growing up, if you grew up in rural America and you can see this in America, I talk about this all the time on the podcast you see this in country songs, anyone who listens to them the women that you're told to look for are not the preening type.
They are the type who hunt and fish and [00:17:00] get dirty with the boys because he wants
Simone Collins: guns who can do all that,
Malcolm Collins: who can intellectually engage with it. But if you only know about Americana culture from country music, you don't see what it's like growing up. I grew up in Texas in a family that's been there for seven generations.
So that's about as old as you get as terms of the Texas family. And it was constantly reinforced in me that when you are looking for qualities in a wife, that you are looking for the qualities you want in your sons. And this was actually a really interesting sort of, cultural hack that Americana culture adapted to subvert the misogyny that also is in that culture.
So
Simone Collins: could it be though, I almost feel like men of the Andrew Tate type. That we're discussing here, just they've dehumanized women to the point where they don't really even see women as like capable of passing on these traits to men, if they're just like anything that's male obviously is to come from me because.
The female is so foreign, so anti male that there's [00:18:00] just no point in even factoring her characteristics into what a son could be because she's not she could never be a son because she is a woman and women are not human. You know what I mean? There's the, even the way that he worded it, like pathetic nine months, gestating children.
He just sees women as gestators.
Malcolm Collins: I'm going to be more generous to him and say that I suspect that you are misunderstanding or not misunderstanding. But not valuing enough the fact that this is just his cultural background, he is from Eastern European cultural background. This was a common mindset in certain parts of like Southeastern European cultural mindsets.
And because of that, he has adapted. This cultural mindset to the current like technological age that we live in, and I think he's done a good job of adapting it, but he just decides to bite the bullet on the downsides of this approach, because it is the approach that dispositionally works for him like he couldn't.[00:19:00]
change himself. Andrew Tate could not change himself in a way that would allow him to attract high quality women.
Simone Collins: And because
Malcolm Collins: of that, from my cultural perspective and because of that there's no point in trying to, be what you're optimized to be. I don't think that Andrew Tate is making a bad bet given who Andrew Tate is genetically.
No, I agree that he's doing what is
Simone Collins: optimally best for him.
Malcolm Collins: And when I look at myself, I have to admit there is a certain amount of cope in my position, right? There is a certain amount of cope and that you just cannot produce children at the rate that his women are going to be able to produce children at, right?
And I can dream of a day where my sons can use You know, exo wombs or use by that I mean like external wombs or wombs that have been genetically, done in different ways that can produce children at a higher rate. I am so excited for that, right? And I will encourage them to do [00:20:00] that.
And through that, they might be able to keep up with individuals using the cultural strategy that people like Andrew Tate are using. But it's just a very different strategy and we're going to do a whole video on this topic. But it reminds me of one of the things that people are always surprised of about us where they're like aren't you afraid of who do you think should have less kids?
Aren't you afraid of these different cultural systems that are having just tons and tons of kids? And it's literally, no. Literally, like to me, they are irrelevant. If the cultural strategy they're choosing is one that is going to cause them to become intergenerationally less strong, less independent and less intelligent because in the future, their numbers don't matter if they are attacking my descendants who have, AI drones and they're coming at them with, AKs and sticks.
They just. They can't even the differentiation between the human groups in terms of their [00:21:00] level of defensibility is exaggerating over time as technology becomes more and more advanced and advanced in an individualized context.
I think that with us, we need to be aware of the downsides to our strategy, which there are.
lower reproductive rate. Maximum, we were talking about it realistically, we're probably going to get 10 kids.
Simone Collins: It's the classic K versus R strategy. Yeah, it's the classic K
Malcolm Collins: versus R strategy. And so then the question is it with his strategy, what he should be totally optimizing around, like for him, genetic selection technology matters much more than it matters for us.
Like IVF, genetic selection technology because he's dealing with a lower quality gene pool to start. So he's got to do more in terms of editing it down. And the other thing that he needs to really look for is how does he ensure that he is choosing women who are [00:22:00] the smartest among the pool of women he can get, which means that if you're going for his cultural strategy, you actually want to devalue attractiveness in female partners to some extent.
So you are overvaluing the types of traits that you're going to find less of within the pool that he's able to attract and his sons are able to attract.
Simone Collins: And if I'm looking at this from his perspective as well, I do think that there are some arbitrage games that one could play. As a polygamist to get smart, high value women who would still be open to being in a polygamist marriage.
So if he plays, for example immigration arbitrage and cultural arbitrage, pursuing women who are otherwise very smart and high achieving and giving them basically access to a level of wealth and comfort that they just would never get at home. Maybe he can really get ambitious, smart people. To join his harem as it were and produce lots of tater tots because he knows better.
And [00:23:00] he's certainly not against putting women to work. I think if he were a little bit smarter about how he managed his women, as it were and it had them doing, maybe he does, had them doing more interesting work than just being like a cam girl. He could create really interesting career opportunities for women and more operate like a weird harem corporate family, where he has like his female employees who have rewarding jobs that are ambitious and interesting and intellectually engaging who are also having his kids who are all enjoying living in this like really nice corporate campus.
Heron palace, I could work.
Malcolm Collins: You've got to keep in mind he has a hierarchy among the women who work for him. And the women who work for him are not cam girling. They are managing women who are cam girl.
Simone Collins: Okay. Then. So you know, like he's competent.
Malcolm Collins: But it's keep in mind. It's not just the women that he's able to secure.
Another thing you have to keep in mind is for his strategy to work. It needs to work intergenerational. That means his sons need to be able to generate because to do this, like [00:24:00] huge wife pool strategy, you need to be able to generate tons of wealth. to implement this. And I don't think his sons are going to implement are going to I don't think he's going to be passing down this talent with the fidelity that I think that he assumes he's passing it down.
Simone Collins: Yeah. What we see with many polygamous families, like when you look at fundamentalist Mormon polygamous families, for example it's super common for the men who don't get chosen to have lots of wives to just get kicked out, The majority of the boys, or at least a significant proportion of the boys just get, get punted.
We saw this also with someone we met who grew up in a cult in Latin America, who was one of what, 10 kids and all of his brothers got kicked out of the cult. He was doing great by the way. He seemed very smart, very capable. But yeah, like I, that there is that problem of what to do in a polygamous, highly competitive culture.
And family, when you have a lot of sons and you want to set them up for success, what do [00:25:00] you do?
Malcolm Collins: Yeah. And you've also got to think about his daughters, right? Are they going to, when they look at what their mothers endured within this lifestyle, and then they realize that they're going to, if they're going to culturally continue his value system endured that.
But for a much poorer man, because there's not many men at Andrew Tate's income level, right? Are they gonna want that? And if they don't want that, then you get the Korea problem, where they just opt out of breeding.
And revolution against him. And I'd say another thing, like a lot of people think that what I'm talking about here Is just the IQ of my wife and that's not it.
Like it is one. I do not want a wife who is a naturally submissive person. I want a wife who submits to me, but I would find it very disgusting to know that my wife, like just culturally speaking was submissive more generally.
Simone Collins: Yeah. Like aside from me being completely. Besotted by you obsessed with [00:26:00] you, creepily stockish about you.
I am fiercely independent to the point where I don't even like receiving gifts or anything from other people because I don't like a feeling of obligation toward anyone. And I hate the idea of being subservient or associated with anyone. And I think that serves us and our culture, our particular culture really well.
Because we want to breed this level of. independence and initiative. So I see what you're saying and I would want that in our kids as well. And I'm glad to see it in them already.
Malcolm Collins: The level of ambition you have, the level of these are also genetically linked traits. If you have a woman who approaches life submissively and that has a genetic component to it that is not linked to her sex chromosome, which it probably isn't entirely, right?
You are getting that in your sons. And I actually suspect that this is why polygynous cultures, typically the men in these cultures have such submissive roles to [00:27:00] their cosmology.
Simone Collins: So I'll
Malcolm Collins: explain what I mean by this. Typically submission to God is seen as much more within these cultures as like groveling.
Like head in the dirt crawling on your knees submission that you don't see as much in cultures where, women aren't expected to be this level of submission culturally. And I suspect what that is a level of inherited submission within the males of this culture that needs to be masturbated in some way.
And the culturally approved way of doing that Is to a supernatural entity whereas you don't see even within you look at Protestant traditions and many of them will say, I am worthless compared to God and stuff like that. But the, the way that correlates to culture isn't like groveling on the floor like a submissive wife, but I'm seeing that as a motivation to work to improve yourself [00:28:00] and as a sign of why you should be grateful for God's interest in you at all.
Which is, I think, really interesting and a sign of how you actually, this mindset ends up breeding submissiveness into men as well.
I thought more about this after recording and came to a new perspective.
I think I might have been misunderstanding high female to male submission cultures or high female to male power distance cultures in that, focusing on the male to female dynamic is the wrong part of the relationship to focus on. It's throughout the entire family system that you have this increased power distance.
You have the increased power distance between man and God, with like additional groveling on the ground and stuff like that, but also between a woman and her children, where, Children in these cultures are often expected to be much more obedient to their parents, wherein cultures like Simone and mine, growing up, , there was no expectation.
Like, children were about equals to the parents. , and people in these [00:29:00] high power to sense cultures are often horrified by that. They're like, why would a parent allow their children to say, you know, No, or allow their Children to say, Actually, I have an alternative perspective on this. , and the answer from the perspective of one of these cultures on whether or not this is correct is just a matter of optimization functions.
There isn't necessarily a correct outcome. Like reality is going to judge which of these cultures is right. But, , the logic from the perspective of the culture that I was told growing up and what Simone and I would tell each other is the goal of child rearing is not to break a child's spirit or to teach them obedience, but to foster a child's spirit and to teach them to stand up to authority.
And if they just, , mindlessly obey their parents, then they are not learning that skill and they will be weak children from the perspective of our culture where weakness is defined by an individual's ability to stand up for their own beliefs, , against, , arbitrary authority.
Malcolm Collins: And if you don't, we've done the video on like the noodling girl and the
Simone Collins: tomboy
Malcolm Collins: [00:30:00] apocalypse,
Look at that. I think every fish I've caught this year has been mean. Look at that.
Malcolm Collins: you look at this girl and this is not the type of girl who's going to go for an Andrew Tate guy.
Yeah. The guy who she's going for is going to be like muscly and stuff like that. But this is a woman who has her own opinions. Yeah. And I think that is really interesting to me and you even see this, in like Amish groups and stuff like that. We've done a video where we have a longer Amish segment where you see a lot of them talking and you can see that women do have opinions within the community and their opinions are valued almost as much as the man's opinions.
This perspective of women's opinions just don't matter is actually not like a historically American perspective or part of our cultural background. So it would be very hard for me to adopt to it in effort to have a ton of wives.
Simone Collins: Yeah. Although it does depend on the specific American culture, right?
When you look at like In early [00:31:00] America, there were some anti woman cultures. With the Cavalier
Malcolm Collins: group, which just, it didn't become that important in American society. Yeah, because
Simone Collins: I inherently think that those cultures are less competitive. So just so
Malcolm Collins: people know what happened to the culture that was more misogynistic, they became the Cavaliers, which is where good old boy, Southern hierarchical.
Yeah, like deep
Simone Collins: South. Deep
Malcolm Collins: South hierarchical culture. So we need to be clear. two core cultural groups within the South. One is the cultural group that I come from, which is the rural group, which is where country music comes from, which is where the girl who goes fishing and hunting and is covered in mud and likes to, mud wrestle and play around with the boys and drink beers.
That's one cultural group in the South. Okay. And that cultural group likes Strong women. Then there's the other cultural group in the South, which was the one that was like the slave owner plantation owners, everything like that. They were very wealthy. They were mostly from the sun owners of aristocrats and they make up a version of like [00:32:00] aristocratic Southern culture, which you still see in places like Charleston and stuff like that.
This is where yeah. The Southern dandy comes from, the guy who rides on his horse and everything is about tradition and everything is about Oh, my lineage, I can trace it. It takes many things back, but this culture mostly went extinct. Most of the misogynistic interpretation in American culture today actually comes from immigrant groups that were more misogynistic in their interpretation, most of the, catholic immigrant groups were a bit more like the Italians and the Irish were a bit more misogynistic in the way that they treated women than the preexisting American cultural groups. And but they were never as far as like the Muslim or Eastern European cultural groups.
Simone Collins: Although I want to be clear, I don't think that polygamy has to go Contrary to women's rights.
And I think that there are many or not many, but there, there are quite a few instances of polygamy culturally and [00:33:00] Anecdotally, like on a one off basis where the women are really more like living almost like a quasi sister or lesbian collective where there's also just happens to be one guy. We've even seen some polyamorous subcultures Geographically locked that kind of end up looking like this.
And so I don't think it's necessarily, sarily harmful to women or anti feminist to engage in polygamy. I think for us, for many people, it's preferred and honestly. In the end, you've got a bunch of women ganging up on a man, he's outnumbered. Keep that in mind when you're looking at these configurations, a man can only hold up his will so far in a household where he's just, outnumbered.
And I think Andrew Tate by pairing up with his brother and other male compatriots in a household like this kind of gives him a little bit of a bulwark, but that is not the normal configuration. in mind. I think that ultimately. What makes polygamy not sustainable and more weak isn't that women are harmed by [00:34:00] it, and isn't that high value men are harmed by it, but that lower value men, less competitive men, are harmed by it.
And that creates problems and instability in society.
Malcolm Collins: That does create instability in society, but I don't think that matters in the current system. I think if you're talking historically, why were polygynous systems culturally selected against? Fine. But now society is becoming more atomized and it's really only the winners that matter anymore.
And if we have
Simone Collins: AI girlfriends and, plenty of other distractions and video games.
Malcolm Collins: And obviously the way that Muslim cultures historically dealt with this is if a guy was gay, they would just transition him. This is true in a lot of Muslim and polygynous cultures is it that, okay, a guy's gay, get him transition.
If you
Simone Collins: can't beat him, join him.
Malcolm Collins: So I think that we both need to realize the downsides of our culture. So with his culture, the thing I would really focus on is you've got the number of kids down. Now, what you need to focus on is Two things, the quality of those kids and their technophilia, like how technically [00:35:00] savvy are they?
And how technically productive are they? And how willing are they to engage in high tech systems
One of the big dangers of his cultural system is that it genuinely believes that physical strength. And physical, like hand to hand combat styles. Has any utility in terms of modern conflicts?
Outside of just making him feel cool about himself and maybe motivating people to exercise. And we'll talk about this much more in the followup video to this, but this is why a group that traditionally doesn't value something like hand to hand combat, like the Israelis in the young Kapore war were able to beat culture that did where those other cultures were fighting them. With a hundred to one manpower
10 to one armors and artillery. It's not that it's bad to focus on fighting. It's just understand that it's just a game. It's a status toy, like a [00:36:00] Maserati don't accidentally bring your Mazda rati into a war because it costs the same as the tank. Just because you spent the same amount of time, effort and industry putting it together as the other culture did a tank, it doesn't mean it's realistically going to stand up to a tank.
Heh, heh,
And here I'd like to quickly address something that we often hear, which is that when I exercise. I feel better. Like it mentally makes me healthier and I perform a better on specific tasks. And this is true. This is something you see in the research. , and so we are not saying don't exercise at all.
I mean, exercise. So my exercise is about five to six hours every day, but she does it well on an elliptical and also typing. , I think that it's very important to recognize the amount of physical exercise that is optimal to improve [00:37:00] mental health while not going further than that. In an amount that becomes. , really just hedonistic status signaling.
And it's very easy to slide into that and to begin to justify that when you begin to engage in it for health purposes, because exercise has addictive properties. And also note here.
The exercise does have some effect on the hormones that your body produces, which in men can be useful for achieving certain mental states that are conducive to productivity and good mental health.
However, you know, this has taken a long ways, the exact same caveat that you need to look at the mental benefits you are getting versus the time trade-off. And the sort of sad thing about exercise. Is the, by the time you can really start to see in a mail that they are regularly exercising. They're almost certainly exercising far more than they need to [00:38:00] for just the mental benefits.
At that point, it is four status signaling.
And so there are general rules around personal austerity would apply, which is to say, you can do it if you want to. You know, I drink and I know it's not useful to me, but I also still recognize it as a sin. And I wouldn't recognize overly exercising or overly indulging in. Pointless arts like martial arts or something like that beyond the, the, , utility they might have, , in terms of mental health for some individuals. And I should note here when I say pointless, I don't mean that they have no utility at all in the modern world. I just mean that there is always something more productive you could spend your time on that would have more utility than them within the modern world.
And finally here, what I note is the things like I suspect you in males have sort of different genetic patterns.
And I think that some males may require exercise and, , fighting like regular physical combat for health, much more than other men do. In the same way that I [00:39:00] don't feel fully, mentally healthy. If I don't do manual labor a few times a week. Like exhaustive manual labor. , which would have been more in line with my cultural history. , as, as a way, a man proves himself to his family instead of fighting.
Malcolm Collins: for us? Our kids, however many generations from now, if our culture keeps evolving in the way we want it to, they will be likely heavily gene edited. They will be engaged really heavily with.
I these are individuals where of the incredibly high fertility cultural groups in the world today, they could have. A hundred members and they wouldn't be able to culturally impose on one of my distant descendants If we play our cards, right they could have 10 000 members and they wouldn't be relevant to one Hey AI swarm kill bot, you know Genetically augmented human with a IQ like five standard deviations of IQ humans today.
Like it's just It would be comical to even think that they could pose a threat or imposition to these sorts of [00:40:00] individuals, which is why we just don't care about them that much.
I love when Luddites are like, oh, that's just wild speculation around, what the future will be like. , no, it's not. We have AI right now and we know it's getting better And for the gene editing, all I can say is our position in profile. Gives us access to knowledge about parts of the state of this technology. The general public, even some scientists in the field. Wouldn't have knowledge of, because it's a field that intrinsically has to stayed very secretive. due to legal regulations and stuff like that before the technology gets perfected. What I can say is I am not being wildly speculative. I am, you know, like people are like HG Wells predicted summary.
That is no simple submarines existed in his time. We're doing the same thing here. We are not making that outlandish of predictions. You are just not living close to the technology that we live close with.
Simone Collins: proposing an alternative approach here, I think.
Malcolm Collins: Yeah. I appreciate the creativity and I [00:41:00] appreciate that he's living by his value system. And I For many, this
Simone Collins: is the best way. Not for us. Yeah.
Now, I need to be clear here. This is not some kumbaya bullshit perspective. I do look down on Andrew Tate from the perspective of my value system, and I would expect my kids to look down on him, and I would be disappointed in one of my daughters for marrying a man like him. I mean, you can just look at his perspective on something like why he tries so hard for the things he tries so hard for.
when people say to me, Tate, you're obsessed with money. I say, no. I'm obsessed with not being in that position. Tate. I'm never going to let me live my, me live my only one life on this planet and waste my years of consciousness in that position.
I don't want to be the guy who's 37 driving a fucking shitty Citroen who gets pulled out on a girl who's too hot for me driving a car I can never afford who can call fucking dudes psycho kickboxers with fucking Lambos and asses to turn up and bust me up. I'm never going to be [00:42:00] that guy. I'm never going to accept that submissive position.
And that's why I say when I talk about money and achievement and training and all these things, how important they are, because if you don't find those things important, well, then you're just accepting your place lower down
Tate is primarily motivated by and stresses about a fear of being powerless, and having other people lord power over him. And that is not what motivates Simone or I. We are motivated by trying to create a culture , and set of cultural interactions that can bring our civilization into the future.
Essentially, bring together a group of rebels that can rebuild A civilization and world that appears to be spiraling into the abyss. When I go to bed at night, I don't think if I fail, then people will lord power over me. I think if I fail, then civilization as we know it collapses.
When I look at my ancestors, that's what they attempted to do as well. very different optimization [00:43:00] functions than when I think about what I stress about. It's not about losing power, it's about giving people bad advice. I wonder if Tate Evers sits around stressing, it was one of the videos I did, uh, did it, did it lead someone to make poor decisions?
I, I don't think he does. He's primarily motivated by how everything reflects on him. And to me, that makes him a lesser person than me. But I need to stress that is to me, because I'm approaching this with a different cultural perspective, the cultural perspective I was raised within. But that doesn't mean I don't hold that perspective.
I do. I fully believe it to be the correct perspective.
Malcolm Collins: I love you to decimum.
Simone Collins: I love you too, gorgeous. What would you like to do next?
Malcolm Collins: So there was another episode that could go as a,
Simone Collins: Compliment to this? You've alluded to it. Compliment
Malcolm Collins: to this episode. Yeah. And it's on who do we not want having kids?
Simone Collins: Oh, all right. Let's do it.
Andrew Tate's Plan to Fix Fertility Rates